Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cosmo99
You may not have said that very thing but you are always great at implying things and then using a comment like the one above when someone calls you out on it. I could post a million things disputing what you post but you would just dispute those also. I used to be a lot like you, get cocky on the fact that I THOUGHT that I was always right, knew everything, so well rounded, up to date on all the politics and such, that goes away when you find out that a great deal of people know a lot more than you ever thought you did. Those same people bring you down a notch or two. You may not have met them yet but sometime in your life you will.
If that's how you want to take it, that i'm implying something, even when I clear it up of whatever comment that was claimed that I said this or that..then it's not my problem then. If I were that wrong, that far off or flat wrong period, it'd be easy to post something to do that, but that doesn't happen and that same excuse is used "well if i did post it, you'd just deny it". I'm not always right, I don't know everything, never claim to be anything close to that and know that there are countless people that know more than I do about things...yet that's cocky? LMAO. I'm knowledgeable on certain things, I usually stick to those topics and check my facts before I do...some of you take that as being a "know it all", I really don't care. As I've said, facts shut anyone up, yet it's the same tired line of "you act like a know it all, no one can argue with you" is played over and over again when you can't prove me wrong on a particular subject.
When I say "prove me wrong" or to "post proof/facts", that's not being cocky, that's knowing I've looked it up/knew something about it beforehand/ read a bit on it and then knowing I'm right on THAT PARTICULAR SUBJECT...not some universal knowledge that I know everything. I'm difficult to debate with because I hardly go spouting off on something and know how to debate(i.e. looking at sources, checking facts within the source and then the whole argument all together). Not that I think I'm always right, when it's not putting myself into situations where I would be wrong.
Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
Now I'd like to see this spread more.
Washington (CNN) -- A broad coalition of Christian, Jewish and Islamic leaders denounced what they described as a rising tide of anti-Muslim bigotry across the United States Tuesday, arguing that such sentiments constitute a betrayal of traditional American principles.
"Freedom of religion is a hallmark of this country," said Ingrid Mattson, head of the Islamic Society of North America. It is time to decide "whether we are going to live up to our values."
"America was not built on hatred. America was built on love," said Washington's Cardinal Theodore McCarrick.
The various leaders are among the founders of the newly formed Interfaith Coalition on Mosques. They addressed the controversial issue during a news conference at Washington's National Press Club.
The coalition released a statement decrying a "disturbing rise in discrimination against Muslims" and declaring that the current "level of hostility, fear mongering and hate speech is unacceptable and un-American."
"We believe the best way to uphold America's democratic values is to ensure that Muslims can exercise the same religious freedom enjoyed by everyone in America," the statement read.
Numerous faith leaders in recent weeks have expressed concerns about hate crimes against American Muslims in the runup to this weekend's anniversary of the September 11, 2001, terror attacks, which coincides with the holiday of Eid-al-Fitr marking the conclusion of the Muslim holy month of Ramadan.
Attorney General Eric Holder is slated to discuss the concern at a Tuesday afternoon meeting with religious leaders at the Justice Department. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton may weigh in on the debate as well when she joins a Ramadan celebration at the State Department Tuesday night. Clinton is expected to deliver remarks around 8 p.m. ET.
Concern over what some observers have termed "Islamophobia" has been heightened by a Florida church's plan to burn copies of the Quran on Saturday, the ninth anniversary of the attacks on New York and Washington.
Also stoking the flames of controversy is the continuing bitter debate over a Muslim community center and mosque planned near ground zero in New York.
Opponents of the plan to build the community center say it is too close to the site of the terror attacks and is an affront to the memory of those who died in the al Qaeda strike. Backers cite, among other things, First Amendment rights and the need to express religious tolerance.
Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, the religious leader behind the project -- officially known as Park51 -- has returned to the United States from an outreach trip to the Middle East, according to Daisy Khan, his wife.
He plans to make a public statement about the debate surrounding the project later this week, although the exact timing of his remarks is unclear.
The project is slated to include a variety of facilities, including a prayer room, a performing arts center, gym, swimming pool and other public spaces. It is planned for a site two blocks from the World Trade Center.
A source familiar with Park51 told CNN's Allan Chernoff last week that the structure is being planned as an 11-story building. It will cover 120,000 square feet -- 10,000 feet of which would be designated for the Muslim prayer space. The developer is considering the possibility of an interfaith education/meditation/prayer space as well, the source said.
Last week, the Council on American-Islamic Relations launched a series of commercials designed to fight what it called growing Islamophobia. One in the series features a Muslim firefighter who was among the first responders on 9/11.
Opponents of the New York Islamic center are "trying to tell the world and tell Americans that Muslims do not belong here. That Muslims are the others, when we are in fact, all Americans," said Nahad Awad, executive director of the council.
"They're trying to portray Muslims as foreigners. This is a dangerous repeat of history. If it's allowed, it's going to hurt all of us," he said.
In a statement on its website, the Dove World Outreach Center in Gainesville, Florida, said it plans to mark the anniversary of the 2001 attacks by burning Qurans this weekend "to warn about the teaching and ideology of Islam, which we do hate as it is hateful."
The pastor of the small church, Terry Jones, has written a book titled "Islam is of the Devil," and the church sells coffee mugs and shirts featuring the phrase.
The U.S. commander in Afghanistan on Monday criticized the church's plan, warning the demonstration "could cause significant problems" for American troops overseas.
"It could endanger troops and it could endanger the overall effort in Afghanistan," Gen. David Petraeus said.
Asked for the president's perspective on the controversy, White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs said Tuesday "the best best place to look for the views of this administration is to look at what Gen. Petraeus said."
"We know that this type of activity is being transmitted back to places like Afghanistan," Gibbs said. "It puts our troops at harm's way ... [and] is a concern to this administration."
Jones told CNN's "American Morning" on Tuesday that he is "taking the general's words" seriously. We are "weighing the situation" and are "praying about it," he said.
But it is "very important that America wakes up," he argued. Radical Islam "must be shown a certain amount of force [and] determination."
The planned event has drawn criticism from Muslims in the United States and overseas, with thousands of Indonesians gathering outside the U.S. Embassy in Jakarta, Indonesia, on Sunday to protest the planned Quran burning.
"Those mainly conservative Christians who respond to their Muslim brothers and sisters -- their fellow Americans -- with anti-Muslim bigotry or hatred, they are openly rejecting... the First Amendment principles of religious liberty which we as evangelical Christians benefit daily," said Rev. Richard Cizik, of the New Evangelical Partnership for the Common Good, at the National Press Club.
"And to those who would exercise derision ... bigotry [and]open rejection of our fellow Americans for their religious faith -- I say shame on you."
Faith leaders denounce anti-Muslim sentiment - CNN.com
Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
I would hate from somebody to list all the bad things that have been done to christian books and people.... O that's right... Christians are evil and are ALWAYS at fault. I forgot. :rolleyes:
Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
I think Bill Maher said the same thing on Jay Leno the other night LOL!! Things like people burning the Bible and burning the American Flag and killing Christians and threatening people over a Koran and burning crosses hardly make the news. But let someone make a cartoon of Muhammed or threaten to burn a Koran and the whole place goes nuts.
Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
Only in a country like the United States can you carry any type of religious book and not be criticized for it. But, go to countries like Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Iran, Jordan, Yemen, etc. and get caught carrying a Bible. It is against the law there and you are subject to stiff penalties and even death in some instances. Now, before you go jumping in and saying that the soldiers carry their Bible over there, some do, but it is never in public. Enjoy the freedoms you have as an American, r13, you may learn one day to wish for them and appreciate them. This freedom of speech you so dearly love to express was given to us all by many people before our time. All we are trying to tell you on here is to use a little discretion while using your right.
Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
centennialdawg, I was researching this last night and found numerous websites where it stated that our military overseas were not allowed to carry around the bible in public for the fear of backlash and because those in the Middle East countries would think that we were trying to convert those in the Islamic religion to Christianity. It amazed me......
Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
It may surprise most of you all, but just speaking of The Bible over there can get you in trouble. When I was there, even the chaplains were not allowed to carry one off the compound, and definately were not allowed to wear any christian symbol on them at all. Even the Red Cross was not allowed to display their famour "red cross" on the ambulances. Instead, they used the muslim equivalent "red crescent"
Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Milk3
I would hate from somebody to list all the bad things that have been done to christian books and people.... O that's right... Christians are evil and are ALWAYS at fault. I forgot. :rolleyes:
Go ahead, that's twice I've said go for it, I'll stack up the ones on the other side too. This is all recent. But no one ever said any of that, of course they isn't always there fault or anything, but these are and that's what I posted.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cosmo99
Things like people burning the Bible and burning the American Flag and killing Christians and threatening people over a Koran and burning crosses hardly make the news.
Yet you somehow know about them, huh? Your examples seem to be in foreign countries, so some probably don't make the news but a lot do and if it happens here, it usually always is on the news nationally and always local.
Hell everything I've posted in this thread has not only been here in the US, but happened very recently.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
centennialdawg
Only in a country like the United States can you carry any type of religious book and not be criticized for it. But, go to countries like Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Iran, Jordan, Yemen, etc. and get caught carrying a Bible. It is against the law there and you are subject to stiff penalties and even death in some instances. Now, before you go jumping in and saying that the soldiers carry their Bible over there, some do, but it is never in public. Enjoy the freedoms you have as an American, r13, you may learn one day to wish for them and appreciate them. This freedom of speech you so dearly love to express was given to us all by many people before our time. All we are trying to tell you on here is to use a little discretion while using your right.
Or most other countries in the world, which have freedom of religion. If you mean not be criticized by the gov that is, if you're saying that no one will criticize you for carrying something like that here...then that's just wrong. Iran is probably the only one out of those you have a case for if we're talking, Saudi Arabia maybe, but countries like Jordan are the exact opposite - they are pretty big champions of religious freedoms actually and religion plays really no part in their gov. I don't know where you got that one.
Total myth that we're somehow the only country that has freedom of religion or they crackdown on Christians or others everywhere else. Actually I'm pretty sure all or most of those countries you mentioned have a pretty decent christian population and that whole "put to death" thing is total bull. Maybe it's happened before in some place like Iran, but nothing on the scale you're mentioning. Even the fellow muslims that get punished get news and are stopped(i.e. the woman who supposedly committed adultery and got worldwide outcry). All that isn't as widespread as that bull that is passed around over here claim, it's very rare if it does happen and is limited to a handful of usually dictator run countries.
Where did you pull that one out? Who said anything about soldiers doing anything? That doesn't really happen that much either, as it shouldn't, only causes so many more problems. And I haven't said anything outrageous or close to it, funny though how those anti "political correctness" goes out the door when some hear something they don't like.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cosmo99
centennialdawg, I was researching this last night and found numerous websites where it stated that our military overseas were not allowed to carry around the bible in public for the fear of backlash and because those in the Middle East countries would think that we were trying to convert those in the Islamic religion to Christianity. It amazed me......
They aren't allowed to carry religious text in public, not just the Bible. And it's not "fear of backlash", it's because in a foreign country...you can just carry around something like that in the open and have people not assume you're doing some kind of conversion - especially since that's what they are told about why we're fighting. Not to mention there has been some that have tried to do that, the military confiscated a whole shit ton of Bibles that were sent over there to be passed out to the locals - this was in the news not long ago. You shouldn't be too amazed, it does happen and it can very easily be interpreted as that in a foreign country...pretty logical.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
centennialdawg
It may surprise most of you all, but just speaking of The Bible over there can get you in trouble. When I was there, even the chaplains were not allowed to carry one off the compound, and definately were not allowed to wear any christian symbol on them at all. Even the Red Cross was not allowed to display their famour "red cross" on the ambulances. Instead, they used the muslim equivalent "red crescent"
Where exactly? Doubt it happens that much or at all, so yeah it's surprising, like I've said...limited to maybe countries like Iran. And that last part is just flat out wrong, you do realize what the International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement is, right? It's just the symbol used in different countries depending on, usually a Red Crescent is used in Islamic countries, the cross in Christian countries, they have the Red Star of David for jewish area's etc. Not because it's banned, but is used by the organization itself wherever it's at.
Re: Things like this is why I take up for Muslims here...
LOL@you, you have never been there, you don't know. You go only by what you can find on the internet. In the real world, the one that I live in, you go to jail for talking about the Bible and christianity in those countries. Saudi Arabia and Kuwait have, to an extent allowed some religious freedom now that the U.S. troops are there. Like I said, you have no idea about this except what you have read. Enough said to you about this subject. That's it. You just don't know.
